limits to players ability!!

[and the Iron Fist]

Phil Taylor i'd suspect loves Rod Harrington doing alot of his mind games for him and probably why Taylor repeatedly goes on about practice. Taylor practices 2 hours a day according to ex practice partners. I'd expect alot of the top pros match that.

G Anderson for example said he can average 120 in practice but in tv tournaments his mean average is mid nineties. I doubt theres a huge difference between Taylors practice and stage games. On floor tournaments Taylors averages largely stay consistent with his tv game but most players averages shoot up. Solving these riddles is the answer to the question not Taylor's mythical 15 hour practice sessions (2 hours in reality!).

But Rod will likely still be banging on about practice in 5 years time...

I think you're missing the point, which is NOT if all the players practised as much as Taylor would they be as good as him but do they do everything they can to try and maximise their ability.

Everytime a player comes offstage having played badly and says 'it just didn't happen today' or 'i just didn't feel right' then there is something they weren't doing right. It's not some epheremal magical property that makes someone perform or not perform, it's not capricious fate - it's pure ballistics. If you don't throw 'em right then they don't go in the target. Too many of the players seem to just accept that they will be inconsistent instead of trying to work out what makes them inconsistent and doing something about it. Maybe they have tried to work it out but just can't. Sure, there's no point torturing yourself abut a defeat, that would be counter-productive, but you have to be able to analyse your game, your performance, your preperation to try and work out what you were / are doing wrong so that you can put it right. That's just common sense.

It's not about X amount of practise; there's loads of things that could be improved without even touching a dart: stamina, coping with heat, fitness, concentration excercises, positive mental attitude, channeling frustration / aggression and so much more.

It depends how badly you want it and how much you're willing to put in.

I don't think i've ever heard Rod Harrington saying that anyone should just be chucking darts at a board 8 hours a day.

[boommoob2]

Phil Taylor i'd suspect loves Rod Harrington doing alot of his mind games for him and probably why Taylor repeatedly goes on about practice. Taylor practices 2 hours a day according to ex practice partners. I'd expect alot of the top pros match that.

G Anderson for example said he can average 120 in practice but in tv tournaments his mean average is mid nineties. I doubt theres a huge difference between Taylors practice and stage games. On floor tournaments Taylors averages largely stay consistent with his tv game but most players averages shoot up. Solving these riddles is the answer to the question not Taylor's mythical 15 hour practice sessions (2 hours in reality!).

But Rod will likely still be banging on about practice in 5 years time...

I think you're missing the point, which is NOT if all the players practised as much as Taylor would they be as good as him but do they do everything they can to try and maximise their ability.

Everytime a player comes offstage having played badly and says 'it just didn't happen today' or 'i just didn't feel right' then there is something they weren't doing right. It's not some epheremal magical property that makes someone perform or not perform, it's not capricious fate - it's pure ballistics. If you don't throw 'em right then they don't go in the target. Too many of the players seem to just accept that they will be inconsistent instead of trying to work out what makes them inconsistent and doing something about it. Maybe they have tried to work it out but just can't. Sure, there's no point torturing yourself abut a defeat, that would be counter-productive, but you have to be able to analyse your game, your performance, your preperation to try and work out what you were / are doing wrong so that you can put it right. That's just common sense.

It's not about X amount of practise; there's loads of things that could be improved without even touching a dart: stamina, coping with heat, fitness, concentration excercises, positive mental attitude, channeling frustration / aggression and so much more.

It depends how badly you want it and how much you're willing to put in.

I don't think i've ever heard Rod Harrington saying that anyone should just be chucking darts at a board 8 hours a day.

But people including Rod keep going on about more practice which is garbage thats what i was responding to. Taylors unbeatable until now attributes are mind games/getting under players skin and mental toughness. That's where everything lies and i dont think you can teach that. I just think we'l have to wait for another phenom to turn up or Taylor to retire to level the playing field.

As an example i'd bet money that Taylors huge goal now is breaking Barney mentally again. How'd you teach that?.

[Rout]

Let me know what odds you get on that.

[boommoob2]

Let me know what odds you get on that.

Not a betting man. It's obviouslyrudimentary but just emphasizing what i observe. Who cares though i suspect Taylor will keep on winning no matter what.

[Darter]

You can practise all you like, day after day hour after hour, consistancy is what you need to be successful.
if you are consistantly throwing high averages then you will be successful. Ask Phil Tayor who is constantly
throwing 100 + averages.
Phil taylor has brought the game of darts to another level from the days of Eric Bristow, John Lowe ect,
with averages going higher and higher, to be fair the majority of players have followed suit and also register
consistantly high 90 averages, and in some cases 100+ averages their problem is they dont do it consistantly.
Imo....Practise will bring consistancy and consistancy will bring success.

Easy when you know how!!!!!!!


Regards Jim.

[PT13]

I think a few people like Chris Mason have said it's garbage that Taylor practices more than alot of the other players it's just mind games.

Phil Taylor has said that it's not how much you practice, but what you do when you do practice and whether it works for you personally. What works for one player would not work for another. It's about always trying to improve your game by trying things outside your comfort zone. In early 2008, Taylor could have just been satisfied with his achievements and just wound down his career from there, but he wanted to not just get back to the top, but to get back to the top and stay there consistently. He knew he'd have to raise his game to a whole new level in order to do so. He went back to the practice board with this in mind after that humiliating loss he suffered against Peter Manley in the 2008 Premier League.

[PT13]

But people including Rod keep going on about more practice which is garbage thats what i was responding to. Taylors unbeatable until now attributes are mind games/getting under players skin and mental toughness. That's where everything lies and i dont think you can teach that. I just think we'l have to wait for another phenom to turn up or Taylor to retire to level the playing field.

When Rod Harrington talks about practice, he isn't talking about some sort of endurance contest where you just spend hours and hours on the practice board. He's talking about working out in your mind what you could improve to make yourself a better player, and then set about doing it. Can all the players say they are doing that? That's why Rod is criticising them.

Phil Taylor always looks to improve his game, even now, despite how enormously high his darts level is. 10 years ago, as the money in PDC tournaments started to go up, people were talking about how great Taylor was with around 8 world titles and consistently averaging in the high 90s and low 100s. That's just average by Taylor's standards today.

How do the other players have a hope of knocking Phil Taylor off his perch if they don't adopt the same way of always looking for ways to improve their game? As things stand, Phil Taylor can reign for as long as he wants as long as he keeps the same desire and is willing to put all the work in.

As an example i'd bet money that Taylors huge goal now is breaking Barney mentally again. How'd you teach that?.

I think Phil wants Barney back in his best form on a consistent basis, in the hope that it will push his (Taylor's) game to even greater heights.

[Rout]

Let me know what odds you get on that.

i suspect Taylor will keep on winning no matter what.

Let me know what odds you get on that.

[Ukfalc]

Interesting question.

I'm more of a snooker player than a dart player, and it has always been my belief that players do have a ceiling to their ability. With regular practice I could knock in 40's and 50's on a snooker table occassionally, but deep down I knew that even if I bought a table and practised several hours a day, but I would never be good enough to play the game professionally - as I didn't have a natural eye or talent for the game.

IIRC Steven Hendry knocked in his first ton break within a few months of starting to play the game, when he was about 11 or 12. On the other hand, I know a player nearly every day for 20+ years at a very good competitive amateur standard before he made his first century break.

Of course there are plenty of things that players can do to try to maximise their abilities, but changing how you do things, overpractising and thinking through every single aspect of your game in great detail can also be detrimental. Didn't Bristow try to get inside people's heads by asking them if they breathed out when throwing their darts, or something similar? Over analysis or making too many changes can just as easily result in a loss of form and confidence - and getting confidence back can be the hardest thing of all.

Rod Harrington criticises players for not being prepared to change their game to try to match Taylor, but then in the next breath he criticises Barney for changing his darts all of the time and suggests that he revert to the dart that he won the 2007 WC with. I thinks its a fine line.

PT is just a once in a lifetime talent. Very few players if any can get close to his level of play on a consistent basis, no matter how much they may want it. Everyone gripsand throws their darts differently and anybody who changes their natural style and grip to try to emulate Taylors' horiizontal bottom of the bed darts and stacking style would risk destroying their their game by doing so.

[Kirk Bevins]

Everyone gripsand throws their darts differently and anybody who changes their natural style and grip to try to emulate Taylors' horiizontal bottom of the bed darts and stacking style would risk destroying their their game by doing so.

I don't think anyone was suggesting this.

[Captain Ash]

I've hit a ceiling of a 3da of 75-80, & can't get over that at the moment, but do feel that if I was spending more time on it, then I should get better.

I have always felt that playing someone of higher ability does raise your game, & you will get sick of losing all the time, so you kick in the reserves to try to beat them...

Onwards & upwards...or downwards

[Kirk Bevins]

so you kick in the reserves to try to beat them...

But what are you actually doing when you kick in the reserves? Throwing harder? Thinking less?.....

[Captain Ash]

so you kick in the reserves to try to beat them...

But what are you actually doing when you kick in the reserves? Throwing harder? Thinking less?.....

Start putting him off

[Ukfalc]

Everyone gripsand throws their darts differently and anybody who changes their natural style and grip to try to emulate Taylors' horiizontal bottom of the bed darts and stacking style would risk destroying their their game by doing so.

I don't think anyone was suggesting this.

The point I was making is that the everyone has their own natural style of throwing and trying to disect every element and and change it too much is as likley to be harmful as it is beneficial.

With Taylor, you could make a very strong argument for saying that the way that he lands his darts in the board low and horixzontal in the T20 and is then able to stack his darts, is what gives him the edge and separates him from the rest. If that is the case, anybody whose throw doesn't natuarally land his darts that way is at a disadvatage, and in a catch 22: they won't beat Taylor without changing what they do, but they risk damaging their game by if they try tofundamentally alter eveverything they do to emulate the Taylor style.

I think it is wrong to suggest that anyone could be as good as PT if they only practised a bit more, or changed their practice routine, or got fitter, or tinkered with their darts etc. Of course there are plenty of players who could improve by making changes to what they do, but I have no doubt that there are also many players who work exteremely hard on every aspect of their game to try to match Taylor, but they just can't do it.

[Kirk Bevins]

Taylor didn't always stack - it's a combination of a slight change of action and a change of stems, weights and, more noticably, flights.