PDC Order of Merit

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Dannyboy
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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by Dannyboy » Sun Dec 30, 2018 8:37 am

Think it is testament to the levels of prize money that £100k in ranking events barely gets you into the top 50.

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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by ChrisW » Sun Dec 30, 2018 10:05 am

Dannyboy wrote:
Sun Dec 30, 2018 8:37 am
Think it is testament to the levels of prize money that £100k in ranking events barely gets you into the top 50.
One more win and he will be top 16 and set up for the year.

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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by Dannyboy » Sun Dec 30, 2018 10:12 am

On prize money... at the end of the 2018 season:
1 player has earned over £2m in prize money in the last 2 years.
3 players have earned over £1m.
At least 9 players will have earned over £500,000.
At least 21 players will have earned over £250,000.
51 players have earned over £100,000.
75 players have earned over £50,000 which is around the average UK wage.
114 players have earned over £30,000 which is around the UK living wage for the south.
219 players have earned over £10,000 in 2 years.
Nearly 3,000 players have earned known money in events in 2 years.

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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by Zapp Brannigan » Mon Dec 31, 2018 12:01 pm

So Smith will end the year 6th or 3rd.

I kinda agree with the comments on twitter last night that the OOM needs looking at, maybe a 1 year rolling or something.

Are the best players in the world currently ?

1 - MVG
2 - Cross
3 - Wright
4 - Ando
5 - Gurney
6 - Smith
7 - Price
8 - Sulovic
9 - Whitlock
10 - Wade

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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by only85 » Mon Dec 31, 2018 12:06 pm

Dannyboy wrote:
Sun Dec 30, 2018 10:12 am
On prize money... at the end of the 2018 season:
1 player has earned over £2m in prize money in the last 2 years.
3 players have earned over £1m.
At least 9 players will have earned over £500,000.
At least 21 players will have earned over £250,000.
51 players have earned over £100,000.
75 players have earned over £50,000 which is around the average UK wage.
114 players have earned over £30,000 which is around the UK living wage for the south.
219 players have earned over £10,000 in 2 years.
Nearly 3,000 players have earned known money in events in 2 years.
It’s that old chestnut how many players are earning good money without winning anything, include pro tour events, for me good money is 40k / year

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PDC Order of Merit

Post by malcy93 » Mon Dec 31, 2018 12:58 pm

Zapp Brannigan wrote:So Smith will end the year 6th or 3rd.

I kinda agree with the comments on twitter last night that the OOM needs looking at, maybe a 1 year rolling or something.

Are the best players in the world currently ?

1 - MVG
2 - Cross
3 - Wright
4 - Ando
5 - Gurney
6 - Smith
7 - Price
8 - Sulovic
9 - Whitlock
10 - Wade
The problem is the skew in prize on the World Championship being so much more than the other majors. Is what flatters Cross in particular.

They should be looking at upping the money for the Matchplay, Grand Prix and Grand Slam to 200k winner and 100k runner-up, but Hearn won’t do that as wants the marketing angle of a massive prize for the World Champion.

There was his recent interview saying in next few years he wants to increase winner’s prize to £1 million.

Would also look at spread of money in Pro Tours as that over inflates the rankings of Pro Tour jobb**** like White. (Who put in an overwrite block on the word I had to star to get accepted !)

Could they do something like you must win a game in the TV events to get money so taking out the guaranteed money you currently get for losing first round.

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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by phil davies » Mon Dec 31, 2018 1:30 pm

Nothing wrong with the OOM in terms of tv events the problem with it how much money their is on floor events which means massively overrated rankings for the likes of White.
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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by phil davies » Mon Dec 31, 2018 1:31 pm

Thinking now anyone have an order of merit just based of the tv ranking events in the last 2 years I’m sure that would be a better reflection of players ranking TBH.
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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by Zapp Brannigan » Mon Dec 31, 2018 2:34 pm

malcy93 wrote:
Zapp Brannigan wrote:So Smith will end the year 6th or 3rd.

I kinda agree with the comments on twitter last night that the OOM needs looking at, maybe a 1 year rolling or something.

Are the best players in the world currently ?

1 - MVG
2 - Cross
3 - Wright
4 - Ando
5 - Gurney
6 - Smith
7 - Price
8 - Sulovic
9 - Whitlock
10 - Wade
The problem is the skew in prize on the World Championship being so much more than the other majors. Is what flatters Cross in particular.

They should be looking at upping the money for the Matchplay, Grand Prix and Grand Slam to 200k winner and 100k runner-up, but Hearn won’t do that as wants the marketing angle of a massive prize for the World Champion.

There was his recent interview saying in next few years he wants to increase winner’s prize to £1 million.

Would also look at spread of money in Pro Tours as that over inflates the rankings of Pro Tour jobb**** like White. (Who put in an overwrite block on the word I had to star to get accepted !)

Could they do something like you must win a game in the TV events to get money so taking out the guaranteed money you currently get for losing first round.
Hearn has spoke last night about changing something with the order of merit. Whether it’s changing prize money or changing the order of merit I don’t know

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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by DavidB » Mon Dec 31, 2018 4:40 pm

phil davies wrote:
Mon Dec 31, 2018 1:30 pm
Nothing wrong with the OOM in terms of tv events the problem with it how much money their is on floor events which means massively overrated rankings for the likes of White.


Isn’t the actual problem is there are too many floor events which means the real top players don’t play them all as they don’t need to??

Perhaps Hearn is thinking along Cat A and B pro tour events - Cat A pays more and there are say 8 of these in a season and then have your Cat B events which pay out less.

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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by Mensur Suljovic Fan » Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:35 am

malcy93 wrote:
Mon Dec 31, 2018 12:58 pm
Zapp Brannigan wrote:So Smith will end the year 6th or 3rd.

I kinda agree with the comments on twitter last night that the OOM needs looking at, maybe a 1 year rolling or something.

Are the best players in the world currently ?

1 - MVG
2 - Cross
3 - Wright
4 - Ando
5 - Gurney
6 - Smith
7 - Price
8 - Sulovic
9 - Whitlock
10 - Wade
The problem is the skew in prize on the World Championship being so much more than the other majors. Is what flatters Cross in particular.

They should be looking at upping the money for the Matchplay, Grand Prix and Grand Slam to 200k winner and 100k runner-up, but Hearn won’t do that as wants the marketing angle of a massive prize for the World Champion.

There was his recent interview saying in next few years he wants to increase winner’s prize to £1 million.

Would also look at spread of money in Pro Tours as that over inflates the rankings of Pro Tour jobb**** like White. (Who put in an overwrite block on the word I had to star to get accepted !)

Could they do something like you must win a game in the TV events to get money so taking out the guaranteed money you currently get for losing first round.
For the seeds like on the Euro Tour, maybe, would mean they would have to earn their money, but at the same time, for players who strive all year to make the big stage, it would be harsh

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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by Mensur Suljovic Fan » Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:36 am

DavidB wrote:
Mon Dec 31, 2018 4:40 pm
phil davies wrote:
Mon Dec 31, 2018 1:30 pm
Nothing wrong with the OOM in terms of tv events the problem with it how much money their is on floor events which means massively overrated rankings for the likes of White.


Isn’t the actual problem is there are too many floor events which means the real top players don’t play them all as they don’t need to??

Perhaps Hearn is thinking along Cat A and B pro tour events - Cat A pays more and there are say 8 of these in a season and then have your Cat B events which pay out less.
Haven't they essentially already done that with the Euro Tour?

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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by Mensur Suljovic Fan » Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:38 am

phil davies wrote:
Mon Dec 31, 2018 1:30 pm
Nothing wrong with the OOM in terms of tv events the problem with it how much money their is on floor events which means massively overrated rankings for the likes of White.
You'd need 10 Players Championship titles to even make what you'd do in a World Championship semi-final. I can't knock White too much, it's not talent he's lacking as his stats for the whole year are remarkable, but he just seems to lack bottle

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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by Mensur Suljovic Fan » Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:39 am

White is also so that high because the guys behind him are hardly doing all they can to force their way above him

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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by Mensur Suljovic Fan » Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:41 am

phil davies wrote:
Mon Dec 31, 2018 1:31 pm
Thinking now anyone have an order of merit just based of the tv ranking events in the last 2 years I’m sure that would be a better reflection of players ranking TBH.
What about the players lower down in the rankings who only make TV events occasionally?

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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by phil davies » Tue Jan 01, 2019 11:10 am

Mensur Suljovic Fan wrote:
Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:38 am
phil davies wrote:
Mon Dec 31, 2018 1:30 pm
Nothing wrong with the OOM in terms of tv events the problem with it how much money their is on floor events which means massively overrated rankings for the likes of White.
You'd need 10 Players Championship titles to even make what you'd do in a World Championship semi-final. I can't knock White too much, it's not talent he's lacking as his stats for the whole year are remarkable, but he just seems to lack bottle
It’s not just him though I think this is much a better ranking just from the ranked tv money in last 2 years. It gives a better reflection of who should be seeded at tv events rather than floor players who are guff on TV getting seedlings.

1st MvG- £795,250
2nd Cross- £591,500
3rd Gando-£461,750
4th Wright-£450,750
5th Gurney-£384,500
6th Smith- £337,000
7th Price- £273,500
8th Mensur- £235,000
9th Wade- £229,750
10th Whitlock-£219,000
11th Chizzy-£160,750
12th Webster-£150,000
13th RvB- £131,250
14th Clayton- £126,250
15th Jamie Lewis-£124,250
16th Adrian Lewis-£118.250

17th West-£117,500
18th White- £116,000
19th Aspinall-£111,750
20th Hendo-£110,500
21st Bunting- £109,000
22nd Norris-£104,500
23rd Cullen- £103,750
24th Kyle Anderson-£97,750
25th Beaton-£95,500
26th Dimitri-£93,500
27th Huybrechts-£92,000
28th Benito-£86,500
29th Wilson-£85,000
30th Wattimena-£84,500
31st Reyes-£78,000
32nd Dobey-£76,500

33rd Brown-£75,000
34th Dolan-£73,250
35th King-£71,750
36th Lennon-£70,500
37th Klaasen-£69,750
38th VvdV-£69,750
39th De Zwaan-£67,500
40th Hopp-£67,000


You see it’s not just White who falls but King goes from 18th all the way down to 35th.
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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by phil davies » Tue Jan 01, 2019 11:12 am

Mensur Suljovic Fan wrote:
Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:41 am
phil davies wrote:
Mon Dec 31, 2018 1:31 pm
Thinking now anyone have an order of merit just based of the tv ranking events in the last 2 years I’m sure that would be a better reflection of players ranking TBH.
What about the players lower down in the rankings who only make TV events occasionally?
They would still qualify by pro tour OPM they just wouldn’t be seeded yet plus if they have a great run they would move up the rankings quicker than if they don’t perform well at the floor events but can do it where it really matters in the tv ranking events.
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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by Mensur Suljovic Fan » Tue Jan 01, 2019 1:32 pm

phil davies wrote:
Tue Jan 01, 2019 11:10 am
Mensur Suljovic Fan wrote:
Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:38 am
phil davies wrote:
Mon Dec 31, 2018 1:30 pm
Nothing wrong with the OOM in terms of tv events the problem with it how much money their is on floor events which means massively overrated rankings for the likes of White.
You'd need 10 Players Championship titles to even make what you'd do in a World Championship semi-final. I can't knock White too much, it's not talent he's lacking as his stats for the whole year are remarkable, but he just seems to lack bottle
It’s not just him though I think this is much a better ranking just from the ranked tv money in last 2 years. It gives a better reflection of who should be seeded at tv events rather than floor players who are guff on TV getting seedlings.

1st MvG- £795,250
2nd Cross- £591,500
3rd Gando-£461,750
4th Wright-£450,750
5th Gurney-£384,500
6th Smith- £337,000
7th Price- £273,500
8th Mensur- £235,000
9th Wade- £229,750
10th Whitlock-£219,000
11th Chizzy-£160,750
12th Webster-£150,000
13th RvB- £131,250
14th Clayton- £126,250
15th Jamie Lewis-£124,250
16th Adrian Lewis-£118.250

17th West-£117,500
18th White- £116,000
19th Aspinall-£111,750
20th Hendo-£110,500
21st Bunting- £109,000
22nd Norris-£104,500
23rd Cullen- £103,750
24th Kyle Anderson-£97,750
25th Beaton-£95,500
26th Dimitri-£93,500
27th Huybrechts-£92,000
28th Benito-£86,500
29th Wilson-£85,000
30th Wattimena-£84,500
31st Reyes-£78,000
32nd Dobey-£76,500

33rd Brown-£75,000
34th Dolan-£73,250
35th King-£71,750
36th Lennon-£70,500
37th Klaasen-£69,750
38th VvdV-£69,750
39th De Zwaan-£67,500
40th Hopp-£67,000


You see it’s not just White who falls but King goes from 18th all the way down to 35th.
Hmmm, it's an alright list, not too different from the real one, but Jamie Lewis at 15 stands out. As much as we talk about the Worlds being too important, this would only exacerbate it

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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by 1205 » Tue Jan 01, 2019 2:09 pm

phil davies wrote:
Mon Dec 31, 2018 1:30 pm
Nothing wrong with the OOM in terms of tv events the problem with it how much money their is on floor events which means massively overrated rankings for the likes of White.
White is pretty exceptional.
The floor events are relatively low value.

Here's an article from July showing how players get their money:
https://www.pdc.tv/news/2018/07/10/stat ... money-game

Since TV events are more valuable, you would expect better players to earn more ranking money on stage.
You can also see how 1 World Championship run can skew things.

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Re: PDC Order of Merit

Post by phil davies » Tue Jan 01, 2019 2:11 pm

Mensur Suljovic Fan wrote:
Tue Jan 01, 2019 1:32 pm
phil davies wrote:
Tue Jan 01, 2019 11:10 am
Mensur Suljovic Fan wrote:
Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:38 am
phil davies wrote:
Mon Dec 31, 2018 1:30 pm
Nothing wrong with the OOM in terms of tv events the problem with it how much money their is on floor events which means massively overrated rankings for the likes of White.
You'd need 10 Players Championship titles to even make what you'd do in a World Championship semi-final. I can't knock White too much, it's not talent he's lacking as his stats for the whole year are remarkable, but he just seems to lack bottle
It’s not just him though I think this is much a better ranking just from the ranked tv money in last 2 years. It gives a better reflection of who should be seeded at tv events rather than floor players who are guff on TV getting seedlings.

1st MvG- £795,250
2nd Cross- £591,500
3rd Gando-£461,750
4th Wright-£450,750
5th Gurney-£384,500
6th Smith- £337,000
7th Price- £273,500
8th Mensur- £235,000
9th Wade- £229,750
10th Whitlock-£219,000
11th Chizzy-£160,750
12th Webster-£150,000
13th RvB- £131,250
14th Clayton- £126,250
15th Jamie Lewis-£124,250
16th Adrian Lewis-£118.250

17th West-£117,500
18th White- £116,000
19th Aspinall-£111,750
20th Hendo-£110,500
21st Bunting- £109,000
22nd Norris-£104,500
23rd Cullen- £103,750
24th Kyle Anderson-£97,750
25th Beaton-£95,500
26th Dimitri-£93,500
27th Huybrechts-£92,000
28th Benito-£86,500
29th Wilson-£85,000
30th Wattimena-£84,500
31st Reyes-£78,000
32nd Dobey-£76,500

33rd Brown-£75,000
34th Dolan-£73,250
35th King-£71,750
36th Lennon-£70,500
37th Klaasen-£69,750
38th VvdV-£69,750
39th De Zwaan-£67,500
40th Hopp-£67,000


You see it’s not just White who falls but King goes from 18th all the way down to 35th.
Hmmm, it's an alright list, not too different from the real one, but Jamie Lewis at 15 stands out. As much as we talk about the Worlds being too important, this would only exacerbate it
The worlds isn’t too important at the end of the day if you do well their you deserve a better ranking as it the premier event and should be worth way more than any other event. The main problem is the UK open which had terrible prize money but if I remember right they have improved that this year.

I think hypothetically if the world was £500,000 for the winner then the other big majors of the Matchplay, Grand Prix, Grand Slam and Uk Open should be £200,000 for the winner and the lesser tv ranking majors of the Euro and players should be £100,000 for the winner.

I think they could probably do with one more ranking TV event as their is already to many non ranking/invitational events on TV. Add another ranking major to make it 8 ranked majors on TV and I think you could make a better 2 year OOM just using the tv rankings. Obviously with the pro tour still being used to qualify for the non seeds.
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